Patrick McHugh — Direct/Cross/Redirect

MR. EVERDELL: No objection.

MR. EVERDELL: Objection. Leading.

MR. EVERDELL: Objection. Basis for knowledge.

MR. EVERDELL: Objection. Leading.

MR. EVERDELL: Yes. Your Honor, I have binders for the witness and for the Court if you would like those.

MR. EVERDELL: May I inquire, your Honor?

MR. EVERDELL: Good afternoon, Mr. McHugh.

MR. EVERDELL: If you see, I've placed a folder of documents near you, but please don't look at those until I direct you to. All right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. Mr. McHugh, you testified that you've been working at JP Morgan bank for 30-odd years; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you've been an executive director since 2017; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. For several years?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. And your current responsibilities I think you said are to work with -- you work with the service teams; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. And also the compliance teams?

MR. EVERDELL: I see. So you mainly focus on supporting the client service teams; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: And before you became executive director, you, yourself, also worked in account services; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, perhaps you can clarify. You were working in a client service capacity for several years in your employment with JP Morgan; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: What that means you're helping out clients at the bank with their accounts; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And so you, in that role, you handled opening bank accounts for customers; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Or you are familiar with how bank accounts are opened?

MR. EVERDELL: I don't think you were personally doing it, you were probably a little bit more senior than that; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: But you're familiar with how bank accounts get opened; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: You and you're familiar with the paperwork that's used to open those accounts?

MR. EVERDELL: And what needs to get filled out in order to open an account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you're familiar with the general process about how these different accounts get opened in addition to the paperwork, the general process of how that happens; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Now, Mr. McHugh, at any point in your 30 years with JP Morgan, did you work with -- did you ever work with high net worth individuals?

MR. EVERDELL: So you worked with people who have tens of millions or hundreds of millions of dollars; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And so you are generally familiar with the banking practices of JP Morgan's high net worth or ultra wealthy clients; right?

MR. EVERDELL: You know generally how they structure and use bank accounts and other types of accounts?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, in your work with high net worth individuals, you became familiar with, for example, how many bank accounts they typically use or the types of bank accounts that they use?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, let me ask it this way: You, yourself, worked with certain high net worth individuals and had relationships with those high net worth individuals?

MR. EVERDELL: And you helped those high net worth individuals open bank accounts or do whatever banking they needed with JP Morgan; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. Now, we saw in the documents you just went through documents showing tens of millions of dollars in a single account; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Right. I think you showed us a document where there was an $18.3 million transfer in one shot; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you said you showed us documents of accounts that were controlled by Jeffrey Epstein?

MR. EVERDELL: Yes. You testified about accounts that were in the name of Jeffrey Epstein?

MR. EVERDELL: Is that fair to say?

MR. EVERDELL: And I think it's fair to say from the documents you testified about that Jeffrey Epstein was a very wealthy individual, wasn't he?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, you've dealt with very high net worth individuals in the past; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And those individuals have multimillions of dollars in their bank accounts, typically; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And the documents we saw for the accounts that were in the name of Jeffrey Epstein at JP Morgan that you just testified about also had many millions of dollars in those accounts; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: Sure. I think if you want to look at Government Exhibit 504 to start with. If we can put that on the screen. That's already in evidence. So we're now looking at Government Exhibit 504, which is in evidence. This is a document you talked about before in your testimony; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And we saw this before and you were shown the upper left-hand corner, this is an account under the name of Jeffrey Epstein?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you go to I think it's page 8 of this document, I think we looked at this page in your testimony; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: The date September 18th of 2002, there was a transfer of $5 million in that account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So this is one example of an account we looked at under the name of Jeffrey Epstein where there were multimillion dollars in the account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. Great. And I think we also looked at accounts that was under the name of Financial Trust Company; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Why don't we just take a quick look at that, Government Exhibit 505. That's Government Exhibit 505 that you're looking at, Mr. McHugh. Do you recall testifying about that in your direct; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And on the top left, that's an account that's under the name of Financial Trust Company; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. And I think we saw a document that indicated that this was controlled by Jeffrey Epstein?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you look at page 6 of this document, and you look at the transactions on October 19th of 1999, which I think we looked at in your testimony in direct; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: That shows a sale of roughly $18.3 million and another transfer of the same amount on the same day; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So here's another example, is it not an account with many, many millions of dollars in an account that's controlled by Jeffrey Epstein; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So I think it's fair to say he had a lot of money?

MR. EVERDELL: Now, from your experience working with high net worth individuals, it's usually the case, isn't it, that people who have this much money don't have it all in one bank account; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, some may, some may not, I suppose; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Can you answer the question, I think, Mr. McHugh?

MR. EVERDELL: You said it depends, and my question was some high net worth individuals may have multiple accounts, I guess some may not; is that fair to say?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. And if they have multiple accounts, they may have money in traditional checking accounts, for example?

MR. EVERDELL: And they may have money in money market accounts, like some of the ones we saw?

MR. EVERDELL: And they may have their money in brokerage accounts so they can use it to buy and sell securities in stocks and bonds?

MR. EVERDELL: And it's true that high net worth individuals like this often have lots of assets; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: Sure. They may have multiple homes?

MR. EVERDELL: They may have planes?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, fair to say that a high net worth individual like the ones you dealt with in the past may have expensive assets that they've purchased, right?

MR. EVERDELL: Your Honor, he said he worked with high net worth individuals in the past. I think this now beyond the kin of someone who worked with these individuals.

MR. EVERDELL: Well, let's go to this, Mr. McHugh. Are you familiar with the term, family office?

MR. EVERDELL: A family office is typically a privately held company that manages the money and the investments of a wealthy family; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: And in those cases, the family office will typically manage the wealth of everyone in the family; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Have you dealt with family offices in the past?

MR. EVERDELL: And in the cases you've dealt with, do the family offices manage the money of the people in that wealthy family?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, you are familiar with what a family office is; right?

MR. EVERDELL: I'm simply trying to reorient the witness, your Honor.

MR. EVERDELL: The family office takes care of the -- typically takes care of the day-to-day transactions for that wealthy family; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, it's typically the case that if you are a very wealthy person who uses a family office like the ones you've dealt with in the past, that the wealthy person is not the one signing the day-to-day checks out of those accounts, the person who runs the family office that does that; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: In your experience with working with family offices in the past, has it been part of your experience that people whose accounts are run through the family offices are not necessarily controlled by them personally?

MR. EVERDELL: Sure. In your experience working with people who have family offices, is it often or sometimes at least the case that the people whose accounts are run by the family office, the transactions through those accounts are handled by someone other than the person whose account it is?

MR. EVERDELL: I'll do my best. I'll try one more time. In your experience working with family offices in the past, is it the case -- is it typically the case that people whose accounts are run through the family office don't necessarily handle the day-to-day transactions through those accounts, it is handled by someone other than the account holder?

MR. EVERDELL: But you've seen that happen in the past, have you, what I just described?

MR. EVERDELL: Yes.

MR. EVERDELL: So someone running the family office would have to be authorized to use those accounts; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: I'll ask the question again. Someone who is running the family office would have to be authorized to use the accounts that he or she was controlling; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And so they could be authorized by being given signatory authority over those accounts; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Let's take one of the money market accounts, for example. You could give somebody signing authority over that account that's not yourself, and that person can sign checks or do transactions on that account -- that person would have that authority to do that without you approving it?

MR. EVERDELL: Let me try to rephrase that, and let's keep it simple with the checking account, a simple checking account. If I have a checking account and I write a check, I can do that because I have signatory authority over that account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: But I can also authorize someone else that's not me to have signing authority over that same account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And that person — if they're properly authorized by me, the account holder — can then sign checks on that account under their own authority because I've given that to them; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: If there is a proper authorization in place; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And that is called signatory authority in that case; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And there are other types of authorities you can give someone over accounts to besides signatory authority; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: I'll give you an example.

MR. EVERDELL: Power of attorney?

MR. EVERDELL: You can give somebody power of attorney authority over an account; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you give that person power of attorney authority over an account, they can use and control that account as if they're the owner; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: You're right. You can specify certain powers, but let me ask this: One of the powers you can specify to the person getting power of attorney is the power to write checks on an account if there is checking involved; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And another authority you can give them is the power to add other signatories to the account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Understood. Understood. All right. Well, let me ask you a few other questions, then. You saw some documents referencing a company called Air Ghislaine; right?

MR. EVERDELL: We discussed -- you discussed those in your direct testimony; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And I think you referenced some line items that appear to show a helicopter purchase involving that company; correct? We can show it to you if you like?

MR. EVERDELL: Sure. Why don't we go to Government Exhibit 502. I'm sorry. Actually, let's go to 501. You've got 501 in front of you, Mr. McHugh?

MR. EVERDELL: And you see that that's a statement from June of 2007 for a company called Air Ghislaine Inc.; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And if we go to page 2 of that document, these are the transactions you spoke about in your direct testimony on June 18th; right? There are two line items on that date; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And the second line item was highlighted for you and it appears to show the purchase of a green helicopter from Sikorsky; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. So now, again, I'm just going to ask you a bit about this practice. Now, is it your experience, having been in banking for 30 years, that people buy assets like planes, larger assets and have them owned by companies?

MR. EVERDELL: Do you know anything about the practice of having larger assets owned by companies or corporate entities?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, let's talk about that transaction that we were just looking at, because I think you've reviewed those statements and you did talk about those in your direct testimony. Now, let's go to Government Exhibit 506, which I think is in evidence. We saw that page in 506; right? You testified about that in your direct?

MR. EVERDELL: I think you said that was a signature card; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Yes. And that is a signature card for the account ending in 4324; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And that's the account that's associated with Air Ghislaine Inc.; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Understood. That's fine. Let's look at the third page of this document, which we didn't see before. Let's go back to the page before, the second page so we can see the complete document. Are we at 506? Is this Government Exhibit 506? Okay. I'm sorry, let's go to page 5. My fault. Go to page 5.

MR. EVERDELL: Must have the wrong one. May I have a moment, your Honor?

MR. EVERDELL: I'm going to move on to a different topic and come back to this one.

MR. EVERDELL: Let's go to Government Exhibit 505. You testified about this document on your direct; right?

MR. EVERDELL: This is an October 1999 statement from Financial Trust Company; right?

MR. EVERDELL: If we go to page 6 of the document and we look at the transactions on October 19th. Do you see those?

MR. EVERDELL: So you testified before that that reflects the sale of money market fund assets of $18.3 million as the first of those two transactions; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And the second is a disbursement transferred by wire to Bear Stearns for account of Ghislaine Maxwell; right?

MR. EVERDELL: But there is nothing on this document that shows what that transfer was for, right, what the purpose of that money was?

MR. EVERDELL: And this document doesn't tell us which accounts at Bear Stearns the money went into; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And it says for the account of Ghislaine Maxwell; right?

MR. EVERDELL: But you testified that there are ways to -- I believe there are ways to set up accounts on other people's behalf if you have the proper authority to do that; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Are there ways to set up an account for someone on their behalf as long as you have proper authorization to do that?

MR. EVERDELL: Understood. But safe to say, we don't know from this document here what this transaction was for; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Let's move on to the transaction you saw in September of 2002, which I believe is Government Exhibit 504. You testified about that document, as well, right, we saw that before?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. So if we look at that document, that is a statement dated September of 2002; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And it's for an account held by Jeffrey Epstein?

MR. EVERDELL: All right. And if you go to page 8, do you see the transactions on September 18th; right?

MR. EVERDELL: You testified about those, that reflects a sale again of about $5 million of a money market fund to generate cash and then a transfer of that $5 million in cash to another account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. Correct. Now, you see that the September 18th entry, it says it's transferred by wire to a Palm Beach NATLBKNTR Co.; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Is that Palm Beach National Bank & Trust Company?

MR. EVERDELL: And that's for the account of Ghislaine Maxwell?

MR. EVERDELL: Again, from this document, we don't know what this transaction was for; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And we don't know what kind of an account that that money went into; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And I want to just focus on the word trust in the name of that bank, Bank & Trust Co. Are you familiar with what a trust account is?

MR. EVERDELL: A trust account — I'm generally summarizing — it holds money for a beneficiary of a trust, but that account is actually controlled by a third party; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So in a trust account, the money is held in an account for a beneficiary of the trust, but the account is actually controlled by a third party; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: What I just described is a type of trust account; is that accurate?

MR. EVERDELL: And it is possible to set up a trust account for someone without them even knowing; is that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Your Honor, may I have a moment to confer with the government?

MR. EVERDELL: Mr. McHugh, I want to ask you now about that 2007 purchase of the helicopter we were looking at before. All right?

MR. EVERDELL: All right. So if we can pull up Government Exhibit 502. Now, before we look at the exhibit, based on what we saw before, it seemed like there was some money that went into this account held by Ghislaine Maxwell that then went out of that account to the account held by Air Ghislaine, and then a similar amount of money going to Sikorsky to pay for the helicopter. Is that an accurate summary of these exhibits we looked at?

MR. EVERDELL: Why don't we take a look at Government Exhibit 2 at page 2. 502, sorry, at page 2. We looked at those transactions on June 15th and June 18th in the middle of the page; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you see that on the 15th, you said that there was money, it appeared coming in from an account held by or associated with Jeffrey Epstein, $7.4 million coming into this account, which appears to be in the name of Ghislaine Maxwell; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And then you saw on June 18th, there was the same amount of money going out from this account under the name of Ghislaine Maxwell to the account of 4324?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you look at Government Exhibit 501, that is the 4324 account, right, where the money ended up?

MR. EVERDELL: And that is a account held by Air Ghislaine?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you look at page 2 of that document, you see on June 18th, $7.4 million coming into the account; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And on June 18th, same day, almost equivalent number, slightly less going out to Sikorsky Aircraft Corporation; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So fair to say it looks like money goes into the account held by Ghislaine Maxwell or in the name of Ghislaine Maxwell from Jeffrey Epstein, money goes out from that account to the Air Ghislaine account and then goes from that account to Sikorsky. Is that a fair summary of what we just looked at?

MR. EVERDELL: So I want to take a look back at that account that's in the name of Ghislaine Maxwell, that's Government Exhibit 502. Now, this document -- and we can go to page 2 where the transfers are. This document doesn't tell you who orchestrated these transactions, does it?

MR. EVERDELL: Sure.

MR. EVERDELL: This document doesn't tell you who was the person who actually initiated these wire transfers that we looked at -- I'll be even more specific. On the transaction on June 18th, the money that's going out of this account to the 4324 account, which is the Air Ghislaine account, this document doesn't tell us who approved that transaction; right?

MR. EVERDELL: It does not?

MR. EVERDELL: It just says that the transaction occurred on that date for that much money, it doesn't say who approved it?

MR. EVERDELL: So it doesn't tell you whether, for example, Ghislaine Maxwell approved that transaction herself; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And, in fact, given our discussion before, anybody who had proper authority over this account could have approved that transaction; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: So even though the account is under the name of Ghislaine Maxwell, this statement can't tell us whether Ghislaine Maxwell actually approved or had anything to do with that transaction?

MR. EVERDELL: And now I want you to look at that same exhibit starting at page 5.

MR. EVERDELL: The same statement, but I want you to now go to page 5, which we didn't look at on direct examination. Do you see that page?

MR. EVERDELL: That has a canceled check on it; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And let's go to the next page, page 6. That also has a series of paid checks on that page; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And that's typical with account statements, when they're sent to the account holder, they include the checks that were drawn on the account for that month; right?

MR. EVERDELL: So these reflect checks that were drawn on the account in that month in the statement of June of 2007; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Now let's look at just the first three of those checks on this page. Do you see those three checks?

MR. EVERDELL: You do see three checks there; right? Okay. This may get a little small for you to see, but I'm going to try to do it. Let's leave this on the screen and put next to it Government Exhibit 506, which is already in evidence. I think we have them both there now. Do you see that, Mr. McHugh?

MR. EVERDELL: Do you see the checks on the left-hand side, which are Government Exhibit 502, and you see on the right-hand side, Government Exhibit 506, which you said was the signature card; right?

MR. EVERDELL: I believe it's the signature card for a different account, but a signature card?

MR. EVERDELL: But it is a signature card; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you see the signature there on the right-hand side for Harry Beller (ph.), secretary?

MR. EVERDELL: And if you look over to the left-hand side on the account that is nominally in the name of Ghislaine Maxwell, do you see all the signatures on those checks for that account?

MR. EVERDELL: That looks like the signature of Harry Beller, doesn't it?

MR. EVERDELL: It certainly doesn't look like the signature of Ghislaine Maxwell that's on the signature card over there, does it?

MR. EVERDELL: So it would appear from these things we're looking at here that Harry Beller had signatory authority over Ghislaine Maxwell's bank account, doesn't it?

MR. EVERDELL: Well, I meant to show you the document on the right so you can see the way the signature looks, but the document on the left shows checks that were drawn on that account in the name of Ghislaine Maxwell, doesn't it?

MR. EVERDELL: From her account, under her name, at least that is the name on the account, Ghislaine Maxwell?

MR. EVERDELL: But those checks appear to be signed by Harry Beller; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: And you wouldn't be able to sign a check on an account unless you had signatory authority on that account or some other proper authority that gave you the authority to sign checks?

MR. EVERDELL: Fair enough. I just want to point out one other things. We can take down 506 at this point. If we could just go back to the sixth page of 502 and look at those checks again, page 6. If we could just quickly look at check numbers 1061 and 1062, I think those are the middle -- those two, the second and third checks. So just to look at a particular check, if you're looking at 1061, that looks like it's a payment for $7 going to someone with the title at the end, DDS; right?

MR. EVERDELL: That's a dentist. Okay. And looking at the next check, it's about $400, that's check 1062, looks like it's going to somebody with an M.D. after their name; right?

MR. EVERDELL: And that's apparently another doctor; right?

MR. EVERDELL: Okay. And those are both signed apparently by Harry Beller from this account?

MR. EVERDELL: And let's look at the last two checks on that page, 1063 and 1064. Do you see those checks?

MR. EVERDELL: If you're looking at 1063, do you see that check is made out to the United States Treasury; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: And that says in the middle line, 2007 form 1040; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: So that's a check to pay for estimated taxes, isn't it?

MR. EVERDELL: So that check shows that Harry Beller is signing a check to pay Ghislaine Maxwell's taxes for that year, doesn't it?

MR. EVERDELL: And the check below, similar, goes to the New York State Income Tax Authority; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: So it would appear from that check that Harry Beller is signing a check on an account held by Ghislaine Maxwell to pay Ghislaine Maxwell state taxes that year; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: Just one moment, your Honor, I'll be able to tell you in a second.

MR. EVERDELL: Just a few followup questions for you, Mr. McHugh. We looked at a number of transactions in your direct testimony and on cross examination from some of these accounts; correct?

MR. EVERDELL: There is nothing on the face of these documents that suggests in any way that any of these transactions was improper; isn't that right?

MR. EVERDELL: But the statements themselves don't indicate anything on their face of any kind of improper activity?

MR. EVERDELL: No further questions, your Honor.

MR. EVERDELL: No objection.

MR. EVERDELL: Nothing further, your Honor.